I’ve known Mignon Dunn for so many years; she’s been a great influence in my musical world from the time I began to study with any seriousness. When I asked her to be interviewed I knew that we had to do something out of the ordinary. We sorted out a live question and answer session with some of the young artists attending the International Institute of Vocal Arts in Chiari, Italy, where Mignon teaches. I was, myself, a graduate of the program and remembered that mine was one of those young, eager faces in the session not too many years before. The questions asked and advice she gave was not unlike my own conversations with her a few years back.
Her advice was as timely then as it is now. How come I forgot a lot of those maxims? As the session got going I was happy to know that I was getting it down on paper for posterity. This is part one of two…
Mary Lutz from McLean, VA: What factors are important about the next step to be taken after college?
Mignon Dunn: I think you have to go for the competitions and apprentice programs. Not just because I’m here [in Chiari] but I think you have to go for programs like this. This is a wonderful stepping stone from school to the next place. You are all people at different levels of progress. Some of you are really professional, some “perched,” meaning ready to go sing, and others who are kind of beginners. Sometimes people come to these programs and find out “Hey, it’s not for me,” which makes perfect sense too. But you need some kind of program like this – some people are lucky enough to go into an apprenticeship program immediately, but that is not always the case.
Contests are important – it’s lovely if you win – but the main thing is that you are heard by many people and you can start your networking. You might get hired even if you don’t win the contest. Then you have to go look the apprentice programs over. But don’t just be so flattered that you are chosen for an apprentice program that you take just anything. Look at it rather carefully because you want to be sure that there is somebody that you can work with around there. If you are happy with the teacher that you are working with, stay with them, for heaven’s sakes! That is really the most important thing. Get your voice in as good shape as you can. Learn your music. Learn how to learn; don’t learn at things. Learn it very carefully and exactly.
And don’t go and audition for something just because you think it’s good for you… go for it! Make sure you are singing well and don’t sing if you are not feeling well or doing well. It’s better to shut your mouth and wait.
Albert Lee from New York, NY: What is the key to vocal longevity?
MD: You’ve got to find a way to live in what you do. When I was young, because I had a very easy top, everyone said, “Oh you’re a soprano.” That happens to a lot of young singers. If there is a light baritone they think he’s a tenor. It’s not always so. I’ve been talked into things. You do it and you don’t do it too well. It also hurts you down the road because they are not going to hire you for something else. It doesn’t the following season but it hurts you a few years later. Be true to your own voice. I used to get offered Lady Macbeth and the Marschallin every year and I would turn them down every year because they didn’t suit me and didn’t feel good. You have to sing where you are comfortable. I don’t mean that you don’t take chances. You have to. But if you go for something and it doesn’t work, don’t do it.
Maria Zouves: When you turned down the roles you were offered, how did you do it?
MD: I said I’m sorry I can’t do it.
MZ: And they understood?
MD: I don’t care (laughter from singers). You know those lovely four simple words, “I’m sorry I can’t.” You can be nice about it. You just say, “Look, this is really not for me. I’ve really worked on it….” Don’t ever turn it down until you’ve worked on it and decided it doesn’t work. Honesty is really the best.
Maurizio Trejo O’Reilly of New York, NY: Within your career what was most magical moment?
MD: I can’t do one. There are many moments, like when you sing something really well. Maybe you’re happy with something you sing two times out of twelve, if you’re really lucky. My husband would come save me in the dressing room because some one would say, “Oh, you were wonderful” and I was just about to say, “I was…” and the hand would come over my mouth from behind to keep me quiet. Because I was just about to say how awful and terrible I was! But the magic happens when you find some music that really suits you, like maybe the last moment of Carmen, that is fantastic and some wonderful places in Lohengrin. It depends on the opera. I like so many kinds of music. If you know you’re doing what the composer wants and you know you’ve got the audience – then that’s what it’s all about! You know how you get paid? When you hear the applause! You don’t want to do it totally for effect, though. You must be honest with the music. Can I tell you my pet peeve? I hate when the phrases are taken out of any kind of form and notes are held as long as you want. It gets “shlocky” and has nothing to do with what the composer wrote. I don’t like it when recitatives are not sung. You have to get them sung before you have the ability to “speak” them. Because remember when you are in those big houses the people who love you are up there [pointing to the balcony]. You have to be heard so you have to sing and work. You can never sing it the way you hear it. From the audience a person singing a beautiful limpid phrase makes it sounds like it’s no effort but in truth they are sweating buckets on the stage. You have to do what you know what to do – what you worked with your teachers and your coaches. One person’s piano is not someone else’s. Try to be as true to the music as possible. My husband taught me that.
Maurizio Trejo O’Reilly: Can you name a discouraging moment?
MD: Oh yes. It was terrible and I just put up with it. I was offered to sing at Bayreuth and at the time I was at the Met doing Walkure. I was dying to sing at Bayreuth and Mr. Bing would not release me for five days! And I let him get away with it! That was probably one of the worst things.
Another thing with Mr. Bing: I finally got a Dalila at the Met and it was really hot. I was good and [Jon] Vickers was fabulous! In the old Met the dressing rooms were off the street and there were people banging on the dressing room doors. It was really wonderful and I was so thrilled. I got into Mr. Bing’s office the day after and I thought “Finally!” All that he offered me was the third lady in The Magic Flute! I thought that it was probably time to go to Europe! I got three opera houses, I kept the Met but I really learned my trade in Europe because you get thirty or forty performances of something and not two. The repetition helped.
Albert Lee: Can you go into more detail about reviews and how young singers should look at reviews.
MD: It’s going to hurt. I think one is always so hard on oneself and tends to remember the bad reviews and not the good. You can lie to yourself but of course you look at them. If all the reviews are the same you had better consider them carefully. Critics either love or really cannot stand me. There was one critic. I really got him back and it was wonderful (laughter from the students). I was over in Moscow doing a modern piece and Sarah Caldwell, who I loved and adored, said that this critic is going to be there the next day. I said, “Well, if he is, I ain’t. So somebody else can sing that role.” The next morning he came with two dozen roses and a bottle of champagne and apologized very, very much! I won’t tell you who he was because now we exchange recipes. But you have to remember that the reviews are not objective always – it’s just one person’s opinion. If a person says something you’ll think about and it’s going to hurt – when people say mean things to you it hurts but you have to take the heat. In a few days it hurts less!
Gina Silverman of San Francisco, CA: When is one ready to go to New York vs. being a bigger fish in a smaller pond?
MD: It depends on what you want. It’s not a question of going to New York. There are a lot of people who make careers from all over the country. It depends on what opportunities you are offered. The only thing about being in a small pond is that the opportunities are less and sometimes you are typed because they have heard you already. Then you’re out of venues. There are people out there who say, “Oh, I heard her five years ago.” The voice may have totally and completely changed but that person was not interested because they made their judgement and they don’t want anything to do with that singer again. This is totally unfair, however, it does happen.
If you want to sing but you don’t particularly care if you make that your prime goal and you want a nice, comfortable life with marriage and children, DO IT. You should have the kind of life you want. Then you can be totally happy teaching and singing in a smaller venue. But I think you make a better teacher if you go out and have some professional experience. But don’t get me wrong, there are a lot of people who have never sung and have become wonderful teachers. My teacher, Armand Boyajain, is, as far as I am concerned, a master, but he never was a singer. I just think that it may be a good idea to have some sort of professional experience. But that is not a given.
Look, everyone, if you really want to be singer there is really nothing else for you. Don’t do it because you want to do it but because you HAVE to do it. That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t have full lives. You should, absolutely. Have fun, have boyfriends and girlfriends and LIVE. That’s what you’re singing about. I don’t think you should lock yourself in a room and not live. Excuse me, but what are you going to sing about ?
