Natalie Dessay holds a firm grip on her position as one of the world’s favorite opera singers, despite a history of nodes and vocal cord surgery, a Fach shift, and controversial opinions regarding staging and drama’s position in the hierarchy of what makes an opera. All which suggests that she must be doing something—a lot of things—right. I sat down with Dessay amid the breathtaking mountains that surround Santa Fe Opera to find out what she knows that we don’t.
How’s it going with La traviata?
Very well. Much better than I thought, actually.
Really?
Yes, because it’s a role for me at the edge of everything—edge of my means, my vocal means.
Dramatic, also?
Yes.
That surprises me.
Dramatically it’s quite difficult. She’s at least three women in one. The first act, second and, then, death. So for once it’s very interesting to play. I mean, not for once—I was very lucky with my roles. For example, I loved La fille du régiment very much, but it’s a comedy. It’s something totally different. And that’s also why [Traviata] was interesting for me, after a “Fille” or a Sonnambula, which is nothing really interesting dramatically.
The way you did it, it was.
But actually it’s not really theatrical. It’s more about the music and beauty of the music. In Traviata it’s about the beauty of the music and the character and the journey she has to go through from the first act until the end.
How did you decide you were ready for it?
I thought that it was time because after that, it would have been too late.
Too late? How?
Because I am 44, and I think after a certain age you can’t start with such a big thing.
Vocally or dramatically?
Vocally. Because, you know, your body gets older, and your voice too. So for difficult things like that, you have to be in good shape.
Which part of it, for you, is difficult?
Second act.
The second act, really? That’s not what I usually hear.
Yes, I know. Of course the first aria is tricky because you have to get involved in a sort of astonishment and a sort of hysteria, in a way. Because she doesn’t want to hear about that. And she doesn’t want to admit that something like love could happen to her. So she refuses. And it’s great to play, actually. But at the end, if you want to be able to do this E-flat, you have to be very careful technically.
Is all that coloratura still easy for you? You don’t do it as much as you used to.
No, because my voice changed, and I don’t have these high notes anymore. I can do an E-flat, but that’s the edge, basically, for me. I do an E for myself in my bathroom, but that’s all.
When you decided to start singing lower repertoire, how did you change the way you vocalized?
I didn’t change it. My voice changed for me.
And you didn’t make any conscious decisions surrounding your technique?
It was not like that; it was not one day to another. It came slowly, slowly. And of course I work now with new people, so of course I change my way of warming up and things like that. I work with two people, actually, one in Paris and one in New York. But they go in the same direction and we try to be very careful with the voice and not to force anything.
Do you have any criteria for choosing a teacher?
Your inner voice has to tell you if it’s right for you or not. If you start to force, to be tired after a lesson, or anything like that, that’s not a good sign. But, everybody has to know for him or herself. Because you’re the one who knows. Nobody else can tell you.
How do you know when a role is vocally suited to you at this time?
I don’t know! I look at the score and I can see if the tessitura is a good one for my voice, and then I have to be very careful about what is the orchestra. That’s why it’s very difficult for me to decide if I can do a new opera—for example, a contemporary opera—because I don’t know what’s underneath. That’s not the only difficulty, but that’s one of them.
Is it a matter of comfort level vocally, like if you’re fatigued?
Yes, and also if it’s very difficult music. I don’t want to spend too much time weeping on the score. It’s already very difficult to learn Traviata because it’s long. It’s difficult vocally [and] technically. For example, I really tried—and it’s not even a contemporary opera, but it’s modern music—[to learn] Lulu by Berg. I really love this music and this character. I really tried to learn it, but it’s beyond my abilities.
Were you trained in an instrument before you started singing?
No—that’s why it’s very difficult for me to learn music.
Can you clarify something for me? I thought I heard somewhere or read somewhere that you had done a Fest contract with Vienna?
Yes, at one point, in 1993-94. I was fixed then.
But you didn’t like it.
No, because I was a slave. And nobody likes to be a slave—even though I was a privileged slave. But that means we are not paid very much and we have to do what they tell us to do. We can’t choose. Plus, because it’s a repertoire theatre, we don’t rehearse. We rehearse three days for a whole opera, which is total nonsense. So that’s why I don’t want to do that anymore.
What part of the rehearsal process is most important to you?
The rehearsal itself—the four weeks, five weeks of rehearsals.
To get into the character, to get it into your voice?
Yes, to get into the character. To build a team, also, with the others. And to have a chance to play something theatrical. And something which is believable and meaningful. Otherwise, it’s just a concert with costumes. Because nobody could assume that you can rehearse a play, a real play, in three days. So why should it be like that for an opera, which is much more difficult because you have the music. So you don’t have to invent as much as in a real play, because in a real play you have only the text [and] you have to create your own music. So it takes a long time. We have already the music—which tells something else, sometimes, [than does] the text, but still you have to put that all together.
So you did a Fest contract but you never did an apprenticeship, like they have here?
No, but at one point I was at the school of the Opéra de Paris, for one year, one year and a half, something like that. It was a sort of apprentice program.
If you were to go back 20 years and start over, what career path would you take?
I think I would go to the States.
Would you try to get an apprenticeship like they have here at Santa Fe?
I would go to the Juilliard School or something like that.
And then go from there to try to get an apprenticeship maybe, or would you try directly for an agency? It’s a very difficult thing for young singers to decide.
Yeah, but I think the training here is quite interesting and quite wide, in terms of opportunities and meetings with people. I have the impression; maybe I’m wrong. And also technically, I think that American people are—not all of them, but most of them—really well prepared technically.
About the acting thing, because I know that’s your thing . . .
Yes.
How do you feel that you learned to act? Was it from a teacher or a method?
No. I mean, first of all, from 18 to 20, I was a theater student because I wanted to become an actress. So I got a real training, even if it was short. Exercises, improvisation. And I was able to work on the text, on the words, precisely. And I would recommend every young opera singer to have that training of pure theater.
Did you find a particular method or teacher that worked for you? Because all the teachers have their own opinions.
It’s not very important the way you train. The important thing is to train. You can train with the Lee Strasberg method, but you can train also with an English method or a French method, as long as you train. It’s a process of discovering yourself and your possibilities. So, any training is good training.
It builds your confidence.
Yes. And there are so many things to learn. And it’s such a personal thing, also, to learn how to be an actor. There’s no method that works for everybody. It’s like learning singing. You have to find your own path. And at the beginning, every path is a good one, because you don’t know anything.
I took acting at L’Ecole Normale de Musique for a year, and I found that the method was very different from what I learned in the States.
Yes, because we French people, for example, spend a lot of time on speaking the right way, which is not the American training or the English training or even the German training. Everything is more intellectual for us, I think. And also, I discussed with people who had both trainings, the American one and the French one, and it was very interesting to see how the approach of the body, for example, was very different from one country to another.
We are very much into how to build the phrase, because French is a very flat language. So the way you build the phrase, and the intonation on the words, can change the whole sense of the same phrase. And it’s very important in French, more important in French than in another language.
Where I went to school, most of the students didn’t speak fluent French, so we didn’t spend that much time on text.
Ah! Because, for French people, they spend at least two years only on that—of saying phrases in a right, believable way.
But do you find that translates over very well when you have to act in another language?
Oh, it’s very different then. In another language, as a [foreigner], you have to play much more with your body. And we are not trained like that. We have schools which are more into body training. But it’s apart from the institutional training.
My discovery was that the French class was more about ensemble, whereas the classes here were very individualistic.
Aha! Interesting.
In the class I had in France, if somebody did something that was very creative or something that stood out, the teacher would say, “You’re not playing with the group.”
Ah, yes. It’s a lot also about how to listen to the others. That’s also a very important process for us.
Does your commitment to the theater ever mess up your vocal technique?
Yes, of course. It’s a risk every time. But I think it’s a risk you have to take. It doesn’t mean that you have to sacrifice your voice in order to be believable. Because in the opera it doesn’t work like that. [If] the sound is not correct, I think the people lose the whole commitment to the story. If, because you’re dying, for example, your voice dies also, you are out of the story. So you have to be very careful to be at the edge every time, and not beyond.
Compared to your other colleagues at your level, you don’t cancel very much.
I used to cancel when I had my problems, when I had my surgery. So for four years I was in and out, because I didn’t know what I had. And then we discovered that I had to have surgery, and then it was okay because I was able to rehab then, and to come back. But otherwise, no, because I try not to do too much. Of course you can still be ill for one or two performances, it may happen.
But I try to be very careful not to sign too much in advance and then see what happens. You know? Because I know now what a schedule should be, even on paper. On paper, everything seems to work—and then in real life, if you don’t have three weeks or two weeks of rest in between, it’s dangerous.
So you’d say you learned that the hard way?
Yes.
Did you find, like so many successful singers, that you were being pushed to do too much?
No.
It was all your own choice?
Yes.
Well, you’re a risk taker.
No, I mean, you are the one who is on stage, so you should know. You should know your limits. Of course, you learn with the years. But it’s something that you should learn and you should know for yourself. Everyone is different, also. Look at Plácido Domingo. When you see the schedule of Domingo, you just want to die. But it seems to be right for him. And only for him.
I don’t do more than 45 performances a year, which is much less than most of my colleagues. And it was always like that, even when I was young. So when I had my problems, it was not because I was working too much. It was much more complicated than that. I’ve never done 90 performances a year, like people I know. Never. So it’s a question of dealing with your energy, balancing between your public life and your private life, wanting to have a family life or not. I mean, it’s a whole process.
Would you say your problems were caused by an underlying technical problem, or was it more of an injury?
I will never know. I will never know. I don’t have the impression that I had such a bad technique. But you know, everybody is different. I know people who scream all their life and who have no problem at all. Because here [taps head], they are confident.
You think that’s it?
Oh yeah. It has to do with confidence. It has to do with a feeling of guilt, also. I was very guilty about my children, for example, and things like that. It’s a lot of things that you have to deal with. It’s not only the fact that you sing like [this] or like that. And it’s a question of personality also. You have personalities that give so much on stage that they can hurt themselves. And I was one of them. And other people who are very cool, very detached. Of course it’s easier in that case, even if it’s never easy for anybody.
What other advice do you have for singers?
Learn foreign languages.
Your English is fabulous.
Yeah, but it took me awhile. When I was 27, I didn’t understand a word and I couldn’t speak English at all.
How did you learn?
I learned with TV, basically. And I went to New York a lot of times, so I could learn with my colleagues, with the people I worked with.
You must have an ear for it.
And also, because my first foreign language was German, and German is really difficult. And compared to German, English is so easy. But of course it depends on the level you want to reach. To be able to communicate, English is much easier. But to be able to really possess that language, English is really difficult.
Really?
Yes, because you have a lot of verbs.
We have a lot of verbs we don’t use that much.
Yeah, but you have much more than we have, for example.
Well, in English you can pretty much make up your own words, which you can’t do in France. They have laws about that.
Yes, but if you really want to reach a high level, it takes a lifetime. For example, I don’t dare to read in English for the moment.
Really?
Yeah, because for me it’s too difficult.
And your Italian?
Very bad, because I never learned. So I had to learn when I went to Italy, and it was only maybe three months in my life. So it’s very basic. I can understand, of course, because it’s very close [to] French. And I can speak a little. That’s all. And I forgot my German. I used to speak German very well, and I forgot it because English replaced it.
Other advice?
Have acting lessons. Yoga or dance, or something with your body, so that you can learn how to [act] with your body. That’s very important for an actor. And, of course, find the right teacher.
What do you do to stay in shape?
I just started yoga. And I like it very much.
Doing it here is your first time?
Yes. I mean, I studied here and there a little bit, but I really decided that I’m going to have lessons on a regular basis, and steady basis, as much as possible.
Is there anything else you want to talk about? Singers are always looking for practical information and advice on how to build their careers.
I would add something very important. Especially here in the States, I see a lot of people overweight. And I think they should correct that. Because you have to make people dream. You know what I mean? So, that doesn’t mean you have to be a cover girl or a model to succeed. But it’s important to be in great shape. And I don’t think that if you’re overweight you can be in great shape for a long time. And also on stage, it’s horrible.
To move around?
Yes, and for the costumes, for everything. So it’s important not to be like that. Everybody has a right to be on stage, and it’s not a question of talent, or anything like that. But at least be careful about that. And when you’re overweight, and you know you’re overweight, you should be on a diet. And you should [exercise] in order to be healthy.
And you think that if somebody loses weight in a healthy way, it shouldn’t affect their voice?
No, you have to take your time. If you’re really overweight, it’s a disease; it’s something else. You know, sometimes you can’t get rid of the disease, [and] that’s something else. But if it’s just because you eat too much, and not correctly . . . you have to be careful. That’s all..
